With 2 weeks left in the regular season, here are the updated state tournament indexes. This is based solely on the state tournament formula and a few key games next week could shake things up.
1. Sallies .7744 2. Concord .7644 3. Archmere .7062 4. St. Mark's .6859 5. St. Andrew's .6837 6. Charter .6435 7. Indian River .6375 8. Cape Henlopen .6209 9. William Penn .6167 10. CR .6093 11. Sussex Tech .6006 12. Dover .5963 13. Sussex Central .5866 14. St. E's .5857 15. Brandywine .5642 16. DMA .5431
Should be an interesting final two weeks. Will update again as we get closer!
Posted on 10/23 12:13 PM | IP: Logged
Your list and mine are fairly close but I'm not sure how you have Sallies at .7744? I have them at .7534 Record is .8718 and strength is .6350
Posted on 10/23 9:00 PM | IP: Logged
After # 8 they are all pretenders
Posted on 10/23 9:08 PM | IP: Logged
And FYI if your using delawareonline for your records under standing, there is a mistake. Brandywine is 9-3 not 8-4 and AI is 1-10-1 not 2-9-1. That game reported wrong after it was played. And a few other team standings are not the same as on the teams web site. Delawareonline is a nice starting point but its not 100%.
Posted on 10/23 9:24 PM | IP: Logged
The rankings just go to show that if you are a mediocre team in the henelopen conference like CR/Dover then you have an easy ticket to the tournament. CR and Dover really 8 and 10 seeds???? They will get bounced early like every year. Who have they beat outside of their conference. Show me one quality win for CR or Dover? Middletown beat CR and would beat Dover also. IR is the only team that belongs in the tournament from the South! Need a better system to account for the disparity of easy confrences. strenght of schedule just doesn't cut it when the whole conference is bad.
Posted on 10/23 10:12 PM | IP: Logged
yes. there has to be a better way to rank these teams. the henlopen conference is a weak conference with the exception of ir maybe cape and Cr. but still, Cr lost to Middletown very badly, and cape got embarrassed by sallies 7 0. I believe ir did lose to cape though, which makes me question my thinking, but seeing other ir results makes me think it must of been a fluke. but now, we are gonna get teams like brandywine and William Penn who make the tourn but have a bad seeding and lose to an exceptional upstate team. and these teams could probably beat every team in the henlopen conference, again with the exception of ir, maybe Cr and cape. but there needs to be a better way to seed teams
Posted on 10/23 10:41 PM | IP: Logged
Your right on something having to change. I would add Tech in with IR though.
The AD's and/or DIAA need to realize that the Lake's & Laurel's of the state should only put out a JV program. It does neither team any good having a game of such a big mismatch. Its no fun for either team and the coaches are put in a bad situation.
Mount took some heat for the 14-0 score on Howard. I was told that Mount did everything possible to keep that down. I heard they even pulled 2 boys off the field. Yo, Howards AD, JV program only next year!
Posted on 10/23 10:46 PM | IP: Logged
Sallies plays the best team in the country and doesn't get a #1 seed at this point? that's just ridiculous. That has to count for something. You can't tell me a fluke tie is hurting them? No offense, but Sallies JV would good enough to play in the tournament if they could. The seeding system is severely flawed in my opinion. NO one has beat them in the state, they are a nationally ranked team, they play THE best team in the country. That they play ST. Bennies alone makes them a #1 seed, even if Concord goes undefeated. Concord hasn't played the schedule that Sallies has.
Posted on 10/23 10:54 PM | IP: Logged
Relax, nobody thinks that Sallies isn't #1 in Delaware. But just because they play the best team in the U.S. and lose doesn't grant them #1 in DE.
Minnesota just lost to Green Bay but covered the spread, should Minn be looked upon as a really good team just because they played GB close?
And this perceived notion that Sallies plays all these great teams out of state varies from year to year. Some of the teams they played this year have poor records.
Now tying a team like Tat who won't even make the tourney and letting Appo score first who won't make the tourney either is what I see as a red flag. I don't picture Sallies having a loss because it was St B. My mind has them at 11-0-1 and St B. was a scrimmage.
Posted on 10/23 11:19 PM | IP: Logged
Hey fluke ties are part of it. I told one of your parents the other night that sals 2nd 11 are top 5 in state. That being said you can only play your schedule and win those games. Sals can schedule those games because they know 3 4 years from now they will still be loaded, most of the publics can't know that
Posted on 10/24 6:21 AM | IP: Logged
The rankings were used from the individual schools Websites4Sports sites, which has really made the process easier. I think that the system is okay as is, even with all of its flaws. I think we can all agree that the other option the DIAA has it going to the system basketball uses, which gives teams points depending on if they win and if the teams they play are above a certain win percentage benchmark. I think that would make people more unhappy than they are now. All ADs and schools know the system, it has not changed for many years. I give credit to those that understand the system and use it to the best they can...cant fault them for that even if they are downstate!
Posted on 10/24 1:00 PM | IP: Logged
Wal, is youe guy on varsity?
Posted on 10/24 7:49 PM | IP: Logged
Yes, wal's kid is on varsity. Starting as a soph even.
Not sure where your going with this?
Posted on 10/24 8:03 PM | IP: Logged
Even though they have one loss, I think St. Andrews will have a wake up call come tournament time.
Posted on 10/24 8:55 PM | IP: Logged
I wouldn't be so sure about that. Andrews looked good vs Arch the other week. The team is the biggest I've seen this year. The whole team, not just the 6'7"(?) kid they have at striker. Looked like they were all 6' and could move well. They could easily have scored if they knew how to kick a corner into the 18 vs over it. How in the heck do you over shoot a 6'7" kid in the box?
Posted on 10/24 10:00 PM | IP: Logged
PIA, been friends with Wal for 36 years, don't get to see him too often. Used to catch up with him down at the Sallies games before his kid started HS. That is why i asked.
Posted on 10/24 10:41 PM | IP: Logged
are you heading to the charter game I am hoping my schedule allows. tHanks for asking he is doing well, even my jaded judgements allow that he has handled himself fairly well
Posted on 10/25 6:18 AM | IP: Logged
honestly, archmere is not very good. nor do i feel st andrews, or any down state teams are good. there are 4 legit contenders this year (sallies, st marks, concord, and charter) if the tourney can set it up that way dont be surprised to see them in the final four
Posted on 10/25 12:35 PM | IP: Logged
just an update, concord is no longer undefeated. Lost to appo 1-0
Posted on 10/25 9:13 PM | IP: Logged
also, just got news that ir beat sussex central 8-1. what do u guys think about that game? should teams be taking ir seriously this postseason?
Posted on 10/25 9:29 PM | IP: Logged
I am all for talking about other teams and seeing how far they can go in the tournament but it gets to a point where lots of them do not have a chance.. IR they have a few good players and same with a lot of schools up north and down south. And having heart and trying hard is all good but in the end most of the teams just won't have enough skill to stick with the top teams in the state. I think a lot of people need to understand this. If I am wrong and a team comes up big in the tournament good for them and best of luck to every team getting down to the end of the season.
Posted on 10/25 9:37 PM | IP: Logged
What about Milford? They have Sussex central Thursday with a chance to beat them and i think they are in the top 20 in rankings. Do they have a chance to make it to states. They had a rough beginning with some tough teams but they have had 6 wins in a row.
Posted on 10/27 11:42 AM | IP: Logged
Not happening, Milford has six loses already. Beating Sussex Central won't do enough. Central has losses to IR, Seaford, Dover, and CR. Even if Milford beats them they won't make the tournament.
This post was edited on 10/27 5:27 PM by RustyShackleford4
Posted on 10/27 5:26 PM | IP: Logged
You guys should focus on the teams from the north because they have the only real shot of taking states.I don't know why people are still talking about Dover,Cr,Ir, and Seaford they just don't have the skill to compete with the upstate teams.
Posted on 10/27 9:04 PM | IP: Logged
I wasn't focusing on Dover, CR, IR, or Seaford. If you would hop off your high upstate horse for a minute and actually read what I wrote, you would understand that all I was saying is that Milford does not have a chance of making the tournament. Please read the previous posts and clarify yourself with the information before you post thoughtless garbage. Every single comment you have posted has been about how good upstate teams are compared to downstate teams, which is something that everyone already knows.
This post was edited on 10/27 10:55 PM by RustyShackleford4
Posted on 10/27 10:53 PM | IP: Logged
Rusty I don't think he was just talking about you.. The previous comments do mention teams down South. But its the almost the end of the season I don't understand why people are not talking about teams that could actually win the state, but instead talking about teams that might not even make it.
Posted on 10/27 11:11 PM | IP: Logged
He mentioned the four teams I mentioned as Central's losses, as if they were the downstate teams being talked about. The only downstate team that has been mentioned before the Milford guy was IR, who actually is worth being talked about. Having talked to several kids playing in that program and having played for Kilby, I would not be surprised to see them make it out of the first round with ease.
Posted on 10/27 11:14 PM | IP: Logged
Does the state index formula not count ties towards the teams win loss percentage but includes the opponents win/loss percentage on the strength of schedule? It looks like we're down to only about 17 or maybe 18 teams left with a chance at playoffs if I'm reading this right.
Posted on 10/28 4:34 PM | IP: Logged
yeah ir is th biggest threat from all of the southern teams. they have had success in the past such as last year when they were 1 of the final four teams in the tourney. and I believe they beat sallies last year by a few goals if im not mistaken. I think ir is a well coached team that is going to put up a good fight against anyone in the state tournament and should be taken very seriously, along with teams like cape and even tech.
Posted on 10/28 6:38 PM | IP: Logged
That last statement is what I am talking about and disagree with! Cape just lost to sallies 7-0.. and the starters didn't even play any of the second half, how can you say they should be taken seriously? and tech? What good player do they have and what good teams have they beaten to show something?
Posted on 10/29 12:18 AM | IP: Logged
what I was referring to was the fact the these three teams are the teams that are the biggest threat out of the south. I would say ir is the bigger threat than either of these teams, even tho I believe they tied tech and lost to cape. they did win the henlopen conference so must be the best southern team. but with the cape and text issue, what I meant was that in the first round of the playoffs, expect these teams to come out and fight and maybe post a win or two in the tourney
Posted on 10/29 12:43 AM | IP: Logged
Wombatsurprise can you refresh my memory of the score against Sallies.
Posted on 10/31 8:47 PM | IP: Logged
newcastleplayer. are u suggesting that one gameduring the regular season should determine if a team is viewed as a contender or as a team on the outside looking in? because that would then mean that dma would be better than archmere since dma won that game, and also tatnall would be as good as sallies since tat match was a tie. also, then appo, a team that will not make the tournament, is better than a concord team that will probably get the two seed. if so, pending results of the sallies archmere game, your top six would be sallies, tatnall, dma, archmere, appo, concord in that order. with your narrowminded approach to ranking teams based on one game, such as inquiring about only the score of the sallies game with whatever other opponent, your top five based off that same logic would have two teams who wont make the tourney in it! but, as your name states, you are from new castle, so you think the state tournament teams should only be from new castle. but your probably right. based on your top six, you must know something no one else does, because no.one would expect that. so please, enlighten all the depress users. go ahead.
Posted on 10/31 10:55 PM | IP: Logged
Thank you, Wombat. Newcastle has had like a total of five posts on here and literally all he has said is something along the lines of "Southern teams can't hang with Northern teams." Newcastle, everyone that posts/reads posts on here understands that Southern teams are not as competitive, however that doesn't mean they are not worthy of playing in the tournament. One game against Sallies, a program that is arguably one of the best in the nation, that was only 3-0 is not a determining factor of whether they can play or not. If that was the case, then Sallies losing 3-0 to IR last year should have been such an embarrassment that they should have just cancelled the rest of the season. Private schools that have double the enrollment of small Southern Delaware public schools should be better, and if they aren't, then that is pathetic. If you're going to keep posting, please post something worth reading. I am sure an advanced upstate educated mind like your own should be able to put together a decent argument about something other than how bad southern schools are. Thanks.
Posted on 11/1 11:24 AM | IP: Logged
@RustyShackleford4 Well said, But you forgot to mention The Sallies and their recruiting for talent.
Posted on 11/1 4:52 PM | IP: Logged
.
This post was edited on 11/1 7:37 PM by salliesgrad87
Posted on 11/1 6:33 PM | IP: Logged
NewCastlePlayer I am sorry that the south does more with less.They don't recruit from PA or MD they use what they got.Plus nobody likes it when you are condescending.Remember this THE SOUTH WILL RISE AGAIN!!!!WE HAVE TEAMS SUCH AS TECH,IR,CAPE,SEAFORD THAT HAVE HEART AND SKILLS.
Posted on 11/1 6:58 PM | IP: Logged
cinque and ghetto, please dont even go into sallies recruiting. They do not recruit, kids come to them. I am not a sallies person at all and trust me i would love to see some a new team take control. Unfortunately, St. Marks hasnt had the coaching to get kids there, maybe in the future. As for downstate not getting credit, they just havent proven anything in the tournament. When downstate teams do well in the tourney, they will get the respect they want. IR got respect last year, because they were a good team with some real talent. Other than that, I havent seen a team from downstate in the last few years that is a true contender. I am not trying to bad mouth downstate teams, i am just telling you how many of us upstate people see it.
Posted on 11/1 9:36 PM | IP: Logged
Bluehen, your argument is on point, however, nobody is saying that Southern teams are making deep runs into the tournament. Aside from IR last year and Seaford the year before, no Southern teams have pushed deep into the tournament. Although most Southern teams haven't made deep runs in recent years, they have in many cases proven themselves in good out of conference games in the regular season. All I am saying is that teams that have good regular seasons from the South should get recognized come tournament time, because on a good day, they could ruin an upstate teams season.
Posted on 11/1 11:51 PM | IP: Logged
Ir, Tech, Seaford, and Cape are not the only teams down state that are good.Just because they are good this year and made it to the state tournament dose not mean they are the best teams. Even for the up state teams. Some of the up state teams don't play the down state team so you don't know who is the best in the state.
Posted on 11/2 11:20 AM | IP: Logged
the only reason downstate teams can make the tournament is because they dont play more upstate opponents. if the upstate teams played downstate opponents it would be cake games for the better upstate teams..the top upstate teams are clearly better than the top downstate teams
Posted on 11/2 9:30 PM | IP: Logged
people keep saying we need a better system. It isnt perfect, but at least it isnt subjective. No one ever seems to agree on who are the top 16 teams, so thank god we dont have people choosing them. If people upstate think weaker teams from the south get in, it is simple,upstate teams need to schedule at least one or two games with downstate teams. If they win those games, the downstate teams will have more losses and they will have lower seedings and tougher first round games.
Posted on 11/2 9:46 PM | IP: Logged
i agree..so does the rocket scientist next to me lmao jk..but seriously, i definatly agree there should be more scheduled games between up and downstate teams
Posted on 11/2 9:49 PM | IP: Logged
strength of schedule and record go into seeding the teams for the state tournament. and I hate to break it to all of you upstate supremists but THERE ARE BAD UPSTATE TEAMS. there is a reason southern teams get into the state tournament. its called the STATE TOURNAMENT NOT THE UPSTATE TOURNAMENT! period. and upsets happen. everyone knows that sallies and archmere and st marks and concord and st andreas and charter are probably the best teams in the state. but five of those teams will lose and I bet a team from the south takes one of them out. look at the NCAA basketball tournament last year. a semifinal game was #8butler vs #11VCU. I call that an upset. they do happen. even in high school soccer. but is an upstate team losing to a downstate team no matter what the ranking really an upset? no. the only other option is to only take the first four teams and play to semifinals and a final. but how is that fun? then we wont give all the good upstate teams a chance to win. well in the end of the day, it doesn't matter who is in the state tourney. there will be one state champion.
Posted on 11/2 11:34 PM | IP: Logged
Wombat- you are missing the point. Yes there are bad teams upstate, but they play and lose to good upstate teams and dont make the tournament. Bad Henolopen teams play bad henolpoen teams and win and make the tournament.
The problem with the rankings is that when the henelopen teams only play one or two good teams all year then their win percentage gets them in the tournament. Also the SOS gets leveled out in the south because when two bad teams play someone has to win so the strenght of schedule for the conference averages out to 50% or a .5 in the rankings, which again makes it easier than if they would play up noth.
Look at this year. it looks like 6 Henelopen teams will make the tournamet (IR, Cape, Dover, CR, ST and SC.) Only IR has a chance and that is a long shot. When those "tourny" teams from the south played teams from up north they were a combined 2 wins and 8 loses and that includes games against 4 upstate teams that will not make the tourney and one was Wilmington Christian who is well...non competitive. The only semi quality win was IR over Caravel which was not strong this year. So 6 teams qualify with ZERO quality wins on their record!
Until they change the system or the south starts playing more north teams they will continue to have an easier road to the tournament. You would have a better chance of upsets in the tournay if the best teams made it vs. 5 henelopen teams that cant hang. No one wants a north only tounament, but it should be the best 16 teams and that is not what is happening. The more competitive the tournement field is the better the games will be and it will be better soccer and more fun to watch. It is watered down the way it is and not worth the price of admission until the final.
Posted on 11/3 9:01 AM | IP: Logged
The problem is not the downstate teams scheduling too few games against the upstate. If you want more interconference reg. season play, talk to the upstate teams who don't want to dilute their strength of schedule
Posted on 11/3 9:36 AM | IP: Logged
Hey, let's all point fingers, because that is getting things changed.
Posted on 11/3 10:06 AM | IP: Logged
Can we move on from fighting about what teams in the south are going to make it and talk about the games that happen this week and maybe who will get first team and all that good stuff because im tired of reading about IR and Tech and all those GREAT teams down south.
Posted on 11/3 10:16 AM | IP: Logged
OPen tourney for everything but football.....it takes the scheduling out of question,only adds 2 days
Posted on 11/3 10:25 AM | IP: Logged
Well based on my numbers so far it looks like Appo, who should have had a shot a week and half ago, did what they needed by beating Concord, CR and St Thomas More; may not have had the shot we thought they did based on my numbers. Has anyone noticed that Appo with 10 men scored as many goals on Sallies as the rest of the in state teams combined? They beat Concord, so they can be totally competitive with #1 and #2...but just didn't get it in the net every game as reflected in their record. So based on our the index being discussed, Flight A looks to be inferior to Henelopen this year with only 3 teams compared to what looks like 6. If we include Flight B as well its 4 to 6. This is just some of the frustration teams with tough schedules get if they barely miss the tournament. Its just so close on the index there should be some way to balance this type of thing out.
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